ABOUT WAR AND SEX WORK IN UKRAINE WITH POLINA SHYSHKOVA, KYIV

“ALL ABOUT WAR AND SEX WORK IN UKRAINE” IS A SERIES OF INTERVIEWS WITH REGIONAL LEADERS AND PARALEGALS OF THE CHARITY ORGANISATION LEGALIFE-UKRAINE. We are talking about the impact of the war on the lives of Ukrainians, the fate of sex workers in Ukraine. We are comparing what have changed over the time and what remains unchanged.

Today we are talking with POLINA SHYSHKOVA, the leader of the initiative group of sex workers at CO "LEGALIFE-UKRAINE" in Kyiv.

"Polina joined us in March 2022. During this time, a lot has been done to develop the initiative group and support SWs in Kyiv, so I was interested to hear about it firsthand. I also wanted to know more about her personally, her outlook and motivation. I had a lot of questions, so I decided to divide our interview into three blocks: Polina’s personal history and life experience, needs and services for SWs in Kyiv, and public perception of sex work in Ukraine." - Natalia Dorofeeva (CO “Legalife-Ukraine”).

PERSONAL STORY AND LIFE EXPERIENCE

Natalia Dorofeeva (ND): Polina, tell us about yourself - where you was born, where did you study, what did you dream of becoming, what did you do, etc.

Polina Shyshkova (PS): I was born in the town of Konotop, Sumy region, into a middle-class family. My mother worked at a garment factory in one of the office departments, but eventually the factory was closed, and she went to get a new degree in psychology. My father first worked in the forestry, and then in the district road service.

I dreamed of becoming... this is a difficult question. I wasn’t a naive child, I didn’t dream of becoming someone, I just wanted to find a way to earn money. So that I wouldn’t have to live like everyone else, but could do my own thing without wasting time in a low-paid job. Too many people get stuck up to their eyeballs in work without having any idea why, and then complain for a long time about how quickly their youth passed, their strength ran out and their life passed them by. I don’t have such problems, I divide my life into stages and, from time to time, analyse it, about once every month and a half. My dreams have more than come true for this period of time. I plan to buy a motorbike soon, and I’m actively saving for it.

I did well at school, but we didn’t had the money to spend for a long period of time in a higher education institution. So, after a year and a half, I studied to become a hairdresser and fashion designer in Kyiv and started working. I lived wherever I could afford, doing everything I could find: from one-time parcel deliveries, cleaning and elderly care to hairdressing, basic medical care and services in various fields.

ND: So what brought you to CO "Legalife-Ukraine"?

PS: I already had some volunteering experience before the full-scale invasion began, when a friend suggested I try my hand at it. My ex-girlfriend and I were engaged in paralegal support for transgender girls to obtain documents. We created a route, taught doctors and passport office staff how to behave correctly and fill out the documents correctly.

ND: During this year that you have been engaged in community mobilization and providing support to SWs, you could already analyze what you like about working at Legalife-Ukraine, what are the difficulties, are you ready to continue to protect the rights of SWs in the future?

PS: I like the team and Natalia Isaieva as a leader. No one prevents me from experimenting in my work, and I never get bullied, which is a rarity, by the way. In my experience, women’s teams are not as friendly, and it is not easy to work in them.

The most difficult thing about this work is to realise that it is impossible to provide certain types of assistance, and organisations that could theoretically help a person simply make strange conclusions about a person without even seeing them. This is what distinguishes Legalife-Ukraine’s style of work from other charitable organisations: no one jumps to conclusions and does not immediately cut off a person who may seem strange at first glance or whose problems do not seem to require much help.

For me, this job is a chance to realise my potential, to help people, to make new acquaintances. Because if you quit everything that is difficult, you may one day stop getting work at all. You will not achieve well-being if you do not sacrifice what is dear to you. My time is valuable to me, and I donate it to those who need my help.

ND: Polina, in our field, you often must work on weekends and outside of working hours. Do you have time for yourself? Do you have any hobbies or interests?

PS: I have basic options for spending my time: meditative activities, cooking (especially Asian dishes), small trips (at least to the region to see how people live there), painting, doing someone’s make-up (I have a girlfriend Nastya for this). Meditative work activities include cleaning residential and non-residential premises, which usually takes a long time, but a good result lifts my spirits a bit.

NEEDS AND SERVICES FOR SWs IN KYIV

ND: Let’s talk about the changes you observe in the lives of SWs and in the sex work market.  How has the war affected sex workers’ personal lives and everyday life?

PS: Due to the centuries-old stigma of sex outside of marriage in Ukrainian culture, the attitude towards women who have sex for money is very ambiguous... or rather dismissive. Therefore, it is often difficult for them to find a partner who will support and respect them. It often happens that these are men who are in difficult life circumstances themselves. In crisis situations, such men begin to add to the problems with their behaviour, taking out their negative emotions on their partners. This is one of the problems that is not visible at first glance, but it is increasing, and it has a significant impact on the lives of sex workers.

ND: Speaking about the working conditions and earnings of sex workers in Kyiv, has anything changed given the shelling, curfews and other consequences of the war?

PS: Of course. During the blackouts, it is very difficult to work and find a place to meet with a client. The period of time when you can work has decreased. Unscrupulous clients take advantage of this and lure you to their place for the night, and then pay less or not at all.

There have been several cases where a client booked a girl for the night in his village near Kyiv, and when the curfew started, he pulled out a firearm and threatened her. One of the victims ran away from him completely naked over the fence. This information was available only in a closed chat among sex workers in the telegram. The contingent of the chat is girls aged 18-25 who look for clients exclusively online. If not for this chat, more people would have been affected. Now there is also a fine for breaking the curfew, which adds even more risks of being blackmailed.

There are fewer customers, but there are more military men among them, and they are often not local. Prices have gone up in the middle segment, and in the low segment, there is price dumping by young IDPs. In general, there are more and more young SWs who used to not engage in sex work and are now forced to do so - university students, IDPs and single mothers.

“In general, there are more and more young SWs who have never engaged in sex work before and are now forced to do so...”

In addition, due to the unstable situation in the country, many people who enjoy sexual deviations are finding it easier to find performers of their whims at affordable prices. SWs are forced to accept risky practices and services that they have not previously provided. This includes unprotected oral sex in all its possible manifestations, such as blowjob, cunnilingus reception, cunnilingus while serving a bisexual couple, anilingus (by the way, one of the most dangerous types of oral practices). Fisting and strap-on in an active role are also practiced more often, as well as fisting and anal sex without additional protection and preparation.

Young girls now consider it safer to work in salons and men’s clubs. But they do not always receive the money and working conditions they are promised. Various things happen: they are forced to fulfill orders with unwanted types of sex, they blackmail and demand money for anonymity, they record and use videos of services to blackmail clients. All of this has become many times more acute now than in the last 9 years of my personal observations.

“SWs are being forced to accept risky practices and services they did not previously provide”

Some are trying to move to the web-cam because it is safer for their lives or are actively looking for legal work. Clients in times of war can be mentally unstable, each in their own way. They are not necessarily military personnel with PTSD, but often just people with undiagnosed mental disorders. The number of them has become noticeably higher since the start of the full-scale invasion, probably due to the high level of stressful situations.

ND: What do SWs need most of all today, what problems do they come to you with?

PS: Sex work does not provide a stable income. It’s not like in the movies: you go out on the road and there’s a queue of clients, and everyone is so polite and gives you money for nothing. That’s why, from time to time, the only thing that helps the girls out is the food and hygiene kits they receive from CO “Legalife-Ukraine”.

"Often, the SWs call me to talk about life, because they have no one to discuss certain things, especially about work. If every day you feel disrespect and discrimination from others, of course, psychological problems arise.

Not too often, but people also address legal issues. Usually, these are problems with doctors, who behave professionally only if a third party is watching them. That is, I sit next to the client in the office and look like a kite into the eyes of the medical staff and doctors (*joke*).

ND: Do you think these women have the ability to solve these problems on their own, without your help?

PS: I’d be lying if I said that they can’t solve their problems without me. These women have been solving their own problems all their lives. If there has been no help for a very long time in their lives, they rely only on their own strength. In particular, sex workers are used to complaining about violence very little. First of all, they are strong women who try not to look weak under any circumstances. But sometimes there is a need, for example, to leave the abuser, to find a safe place to do so, or to find money to rent a place to live. Sex workers are not very welcome in shelters for abused women.

So, if they do come and we manage to help, the girls are pleasantly surprised and happy.  Any help makes their lives more fulfilling and eases difficult situations.

ND: Polina, tell us in more detail what kind of help you provided to SWs last year as the leader of the initiative group?

PS: Firstly, as I said, it was humanitarian aid: I give out food, hygiene and other kits to girls as part of the projects of CO “Legalife-Ukraine”.

Secondly, it is paralegal assistance. Usually, this refers to receiving services in PND (Psychoneurological Dispensary), polyclinics and other medical institutions. Less often in the CPAS (Center for the Provision of Administrative Services) of the city of Kyiv. The last one is my favorite, I think they remember me in the CPAS of the Obolon district, where they made many documents for transgender women and girls. They know the procedure very well and replace them in the shortest possible time. And most importantly, they always accompany the girl around the offices and say warm words. The last time they said: "Girl, well done for daring to change your passport, all the best in life."

As an example of paralegal assistance, I recently helped a client change her family doctor to get a full body exam. She is now following all the recommendations and is working well with the new doctor.  Another woman had difficulties with renewing her passport because of discrimination, as she had obvious signs of drug use. In one of the state institutions, we were kept in line until the end of the working day and then admitted, but refused service for spurious reasons. The next day we found a wonderful worker who did everything and treated us with the utmost courtesy.

I also regularly hold information sessions for the SWs talk a lot about various relevant topics. Every month we conduct a mini survey to determine the topics of the meetings. Usually, in a month we cover 4 main topics related to medicine, the history of sex work and its regulation in other countries, discuss legal issues, and organise entertainment activities.

I still have applications from the girls for a cultural vacation, for example, to visit a museum or to meet as a group outside the office more often. This is due to the information hunger. I understand this need very well. Due to self-stigma, many people find it difficult to attend cultural events and some public places. The social circle is usually not conducive to such activities. My accompaniment helps them feel confident. They like that I visit them at work or at their place of residence and communicate with them on an equal footing, and people around them see this. This helps them feel more confident in society.

ND: In your opinion, is it possible today to get help for SWs from individuals, entrepreneurs or businesses?

PS: I don’t really hope so. It’s not prestigious, and society is unlikely to approve of it. Some people told me that it would be better if I helped pensioners, children or “normal” large families than “prostitutes”. Stigmatisation is the first thing to overcome. And then everything will change, just like in the case of the LGBT community. More visibility, more people’s stories, and as a result, more understanding of society.

PUBLIC PERCEPTION OF SEX WORK IN UKRAINE

ND: Obviously, one of the main problems of sex work is stigma and, as a result, discrimination. Do you think something is changing in public attitudes towards sex workers, LGBT people, PLHIV and other communities over time?

PS: Earlier there were more myths about HIV, I talk about it a lot now with baristas in coffee shops, bank employees, different people of different ages. Today there are many more questions than blind prejudices. But there are still stereotypes like: “This will never concern me, because I am from a different social environment”", most often said by people over 35. Those who are younger do not entertain themselves with such thoughts.

Once, a barista asked me if I had an oral HIV test and asked me to help conduct the test. That is, young people think more about safety and condom use than middle-aged people. In sex work, it is middle-aged and older men who suggest or insist on having unprotected sex. Their sexual literacy may be limited or non-existent. For example, they often think that it is impossible to catch something through oral sex without a condom.

As for SWs, recently there has been a resurgence of "bloggers" who covertly film girls at their workplaces and post them online. They consider it appropriate to speak disrespectfully and degrade the dignity of sex workers. One of the members of our initiative group is currently monitoring such videos. With the help of group complaints from the community, we will ensure that channels with such content on YouTube are blocked, without prior negotiations and conversations with the authors.

ND: What do you think could have a positive impact on society’s attitude towards sex work and people in this field?

PS: Understanding that sex work is not "easy money", not a way to "learn nothing and do nothing", that it is just a job and many people may find themselves in circumstances where this is the only way to earn money. No professional activity can characterize a person in his or her non-working hours. In personal relationships, on the street, in a store, at the entrance - these are just the same people.

ND: Polina, I thank you for such an informative conversation and for your frankness. I still have two traditional questions for you: what do the SWs dream about today?

PS: About the day when they can feel like full-fledged members of society, treated as normally as anyone else. They dream of protection from the police, no judgement from medical professionals, health, and acceptance from their families and friends.

ND: What are your expectations for the future, what needs to happen to improve the quality and safety of sex workers’ lives?

PS: Only overcoming stigmatization in society, as the first step on this path, can change the speed of achieving a normal life for sex workers. With the current attitude, it is difficult to achieve any results. That is why Natalia Isayeva’s long-term struggle for the rights of the community is titanic. In my opinion, this goal will be achieved very soon. Decriminalisation of sex work will happen, sooner or later.

Interview Natalia Dorofeeva (CO “Legalife-Ukraine”)