ALL ABOUT THE WAR AND SEX WORK IN UKRAINE WITH MARINA CHABAN

“ALL ABOUT THE WAR AND SEX WORK IN UKRAINE” IS A SERIES OF INTERVIEWS WITH REGIONAL LEADERS AND PARALEGALS OF THE CHARITY ORGANISATION LEGALIFE-UKRAINE. We are talking about the impact of the war on the lives of Ukrainians, the fate of sex workers in Ukraine. We are comparing what have changed over the time and what remains unchanged.

Today we are talking with MARINA CHABAN, the leader of the initiative group of sex workers from the CO "Legalife-Ukraine" in Sumy.

Natalia Dorofeeva: Hello, Marina! You’ve joined Legalife relatively recently, so let’s get to know each other. How long have you been in the human rights movement and what issues do you deal with?

Maryna Chaban: I have been working in this field since 2009. I was helping women living with HIV to accept their status and live a full life. The importance of my work is that HIV-positive women should support each other, learn to defend and protect their rights, and overcome self-stigma.  And, of course, to help women with HIV to take ART therapy continuously, which makes it possible to reduce their viral load to zero and avoid serious diseases that arise on the background of HIV infection.

Н: If you don’t mind, please tell us about yourself, your life experience and your path to the human rights movement.

М: I am an ordinary woman, a 3rd category tailor by education. I worked as a seamstress at a factory, then as a junior medical worker at an ambulance station.

I have 2 wonderful daughters, the eldest is already an adult, she is 20 years old and, by the way, she also helps me work with the women of SWs.

I am fond of sewing clothes for dolls and drawing. I enjoy communicating with interesting people, learning new things, walking around our city, going outdoors with my family and friends, and I love animals, especially dogs.

I try to live by two principles: "The best way to get rid of problems in life is to solve them!" - Robert Anthony and "If some people have turned their backs on you, then life has simply rid you of rubbish" - Angelina Jolie.

I have always been outraged by the unfair treatment of vulnerable groups, especially women. I never judge people! I believe that every person, regardless of the choices they have made in life, has the right to personal secrets and privacy!

This became my main goal - to change the attitude of society towards HIV-positive people!

It all started when I was invited to work at the CO ALL-UKRAINIAN NETWORK OF PEOPLE LIVING WITH HIV/AIDS (CO "100 PERCENT LIFE") as a social worker. I worked with women living with HIV, pregnant and postpartum women. At that time, our organisation worked closely with the AIDS center and volunteers. In 2018, in February, I started working at the CO "Positive Women" as a regional coordinator in Sumy region. I continue to work with HIV-positive women.

Н: Do you remember any special moments or events that made you interested in this activity and encouraged you to devote your life to this?

М: Yes, the first event I took part in was dedicated to World AIDS Day. For a whole week, my colleague and I went to schools and gave small lectures about HIV to high school students. It was interesting to observe how troubled teenagers reacted to this topic. Children asked about the consequences of drug addiction, what HIV is and how it is transmitted. As I recall now, we were invited to one school where there was a so-called "problem classes".

After a frank conversation with children, I firmly decided to devote myself to this work.

I BELIEVE THAT WE NEED TO START INFORMING AND EDUCATING YOUNG PEOPLE FIRST, SO WE CAN CHANGE NEGATIVE ATTITUDES TOWARDS VULNERABLE GROUPS

Н: Maryna, given your experience of working in different organisations, with different groups, do you see any peculiarities in working with sex workers, perhaps - difficulties?

М: Previously, Yana Deyneka worked as a representative of the initiative group of CO "Legalife-Ukraine" in Sumy region. She offered to work in this area to me, and I did not immediately agree, because this category is new to me, I had absolutely zero information, and I had no experience at all. I needed time to think and weigh up my options. Would I be able to do it? But I agreed, and I will say that it was not easy for me at first.

I like it when women are happy and thankful for the help they receive. I am "high" from the fact that I was able to help.

The most difficult thing for me is that this category is new, there was no detailed information on the Internet. And even from the beginning it was very difficult to keep the attention of women at information classes, because some of them were under the influence of drugs or simply not interested. But I tried to make these meetings useful for them, looking for information that was relevant to them, and I gradually started to succeed.

N: I often ask our women leaders, and I will ask you too, do you ever have thoughts of quitting everything, going into another field?

M: There was a difficult moment in my life when I left because I was mentally and physically exhausted from communicating with clients, tired of their problems. I think it was work burnout. It was necessary to rest and recharge. After all, 12 years of work in this field is too exhausting for any person. But after six months I came back again because I realised that this was my path and I needed to follow it to the end.

Н: Maryna, your city is almost on the border with Russia, a part of the region was occupied, then it was liberated, now there is constant shelling, etc. How does all this affect life in the region, particularly for female sex workers?

М: I think that this war has affected every person in our country! Anxiety, fear for their future, problems with sleep, aggression, emotional burnout, misunderstandings and conflicts in families. Over the past year, rent, utilities, and food have risen in price, and I noticed that the number of conflicts in families was growing precisely because of the precarious financial situation.

The war has affected all categories of the population, and I think vulnerable categories are more affected...

Due to the general rise in prices, of course, prices for sex services have also increased. But when our city was under occupation, there was no work to speak of. There were no food in the markets, no medicines in the pharmacies, no public transport at all. Private entrepreneurs were selling food right on the street, with huge queues lining up. There was a negative tension among people. Electricity was supplied hourly, and sometimes there was no water. Everyone was surviving as best they could.

THERE WAS NO PRODUCTS IN THE MARKETS, THERE WERE NO MEDICINES IN THE PHARMACIES, LIMITED HOURS OF ELECTRICITY, SOMETIMES THERE WAS NO WATER.

After the liberation, a curfew was gradually introduced until 21.00, which allowed women to earn extra money. Of course, this was not enough to provide for themselves and their loved ones, but it was possible to survive for a while.

Over time, things gradually got better, but people had to adapt to the new realities of life. Young girls working in the sex industry combine online work, webinars and trips to another regions. Some women with whom I work, continue to work despite the risks because they have no other source of income.

Н: Could you please share what they come to you with most often, what their main concerns are, and what support you can offer to SWs?

М: Most often, the girls I work with and communicate with ask for humanitarian assistance, because it is currently a priority. Every month I provide women with humanitarian kits in the form of food and hygiene kits.

As long as this war in our country is ongoing, women from vulnerable groups will need various types of qualified assistance. Requests for psychological and legal assistance have become more frequent, as cases of domestic violence have been increasing recently. Unfortunately, some of the girls keep silent about domestic violence and do not want to seek help.

As a rule, I consult, give advice on what to do and where to go, to which specialist. In general, it all depends on the situation. My goal is to give advice, teach and monitor how a woman will cope with her problems. If it doesn’t work out, then I help.

Also, we conduct information sessions for SWs on the basis of the Harm Reduction Cabinet. In the course of cooperation with my partner, the regional representative of the "Volna" Charitable Foundation,Yana Deyneka, we agreed to invite qualified specialists to the classes: psychologists, lawyers, infectious diseases doctors and gynecologists. We believe that this will have a positive result, as women will receive reliable information and qualified answers to their questions.

Н: Is there anyone else in your city helping the SWs to solve these problems besides Legalife?

M:  In our initiative group of sex workers there are women living with drug addiction (WWUD) and women living with HIV (PLWH), so we help to work with these categories of women together with partners:  Club "Chance" («Шанс»), CO "Positive Women" (БО «Позитивні жінки»), Charitable Foundation CO "Volna", etc. We have been working with partners for a long time.

In October 2023, I visited NGO "Sumy Public Circle" (ГО «Сумське громадське коло») and talked to the head of organisation, and as a result, we planned humanitarian and psychosocial assistance for female sex workers for the next year.

I think that we need to tell more about organisation, about SWs, because, first of all, they are still women! And who lives and how, where they work, that’s everyone’s choice! And there is no need to judge anyone!

Н: For many years now, CO "Legalife-Ukraine" has been implementing various public awareness activities in an attempt to reduce the level of stigma and discrimination against SWs. In your opinion, has anything changed in the public attitude towards sex workers and PLHIV and PWUD communities recently?

М: Our city is not a metropolis, it is small and, in my opinion, most people live "conservatively". So, to be honest, I haven’t felt any big changes, maybe there are some minor ones.

I think it all depends on how much people know about this topic, so we can expect a positive or negative attitude.

During my time of working in this field, I heard many negative statements from people about SWs, PLHIV, and PWUD. All these categories face labelling, distrust, devaluation of them as individuals, psychological pressure and verbal abuse. Of course, such perceptions are harmful to SWs because they affect their self-esteem, self-realisation, choice of field of activity, and partnerships.

A LOT OF EFFORT AND TIME IS NEEDED TO INCREASE THE LEVEL OF TOLERANCE IN SOCIETY

Н: Marina, thank you for this conversation! Traditionally, I have a final questions: what do you think sex workers dream about today? And what do you personally hope for in the future that could make the lives of sex workers safer and better?

I hope that sex work will be legalised, so that sex workers can work in peace.

And I am sure that all sex workers dream of peace in our country, happy children, safe and stable work.

Interview by Natalya Dorofeeva (CO “Legalife-Ukraine”)